Where is the fuel pump relay located on an 04 5.9? This is still probable and we’d suggest checking for any codes, and if P0216 is present, you are definitely due for a new pump. In other words, it means that the desired pressure as commanded by the ECM is not the actual pressure, which of course, could be a multitude of things. We’ve had numerous people tell us they’re not getting “anything” to the rail, when in fact its adequate and merely a bad pressure relief valve is causing the issue, so I’d recommend also pulling the return line off the top of that and visually checking for fuel, again, as described in this writeup. Have tested relays and all are good. Went over the truck and got it buttoned up, had it idling for about 15 min. Thanks for the question, lets see if we can help figure out your issue. I would monitor this while the issue is occurring to see if pressure drops when pulling a grade. This fuel system is designed to handle exceptionally high pressure, so a small spike in pressure for .00001 of a second should not cause any damage. At that point, as you’re trying to start the truck its returning excessive fuel. In many instances, the longer the truck sits, it will become easier to start due to a high return rate of the injectors. Thanks in Advance. So does the fuel pump retrofit eliminate the hoising mounted lift pump? Truck wonât start. Since then it has gotten long up to 15 seconds and sometimes an initial of 15 followed by 10. Is this the most likely scenario? However, this can be a finicky system, so it would be a good thing to check, and its easy enough to do so. You should be able to bump the key and listen for the hum of the pump at the fuel tank. Any ideas, 2002 F350 Super Duty, Crew Cab,Long box,4x4, 7.3 PSD, Complete rebuild .010 over by myself except balancing, 2000hp billet connecting rods, ARP main and head studs, ceramic coated pistons, Smith Bros Chrome Molly push rods, Comp Cams springs, shims and seals. The first thing to check if you can is actual lift pump pressure. It seems I may have 2-3 issues that may be going on. Before I do, the not start problem I’m having is when we drive our 2007 dodge ram and park it and try to re-start it again in about 2-5 minutes later. If that’s correct, you need to leave the rail pressure sensor plugged in and only unplug the FCA, then try to start. Once the line is removed, crank the truck. Commonly, these valves will get stuck in the open position and stay that way when the truck is turned off. Long start when cold (less than 50 degF), and no start (unless you use starting fluid) when it’s really cold (less than 25 degF). After you’ve done this, you should ordinarily return a code P0712 (low temperature error). The pressure relief valve is designed to do just as the name implies, relieve pressure. In order to prove this theory, you could let the truck sit for the 6+ hours as you’ve described, but then have another vehicle running next to yours and connect the batteries with a pair of jumper cables (go to your known bad battery) and see if the hard start issue is still there. See if it is relieving fuel when you are cranking the truck. http://youtu.be/PIPP_sPtofw. All of the above tests are intended for the do-it-yourselfer, and will typically lead to the underlying cause of the issue in most instances we have encountered. If nothing, then its confirmed you’re either not getting power to the pump or the pump is bad. Thanks for the input and I will post my findings! The overhead display is dead. truck never ran rough or anything. With the valve cover off, you should be able to reach your hand back there and feel for the correct line and follow it down to its connection. The one thing I didn’t mention so far is one of the earlier mechanics asking me if I had recently run the truck out of diesel. Unfortunately, this sounds like a lot more than a fuel related issue. Cranking no start. If you’re able to test what the fuel return volume of the injectors are for 10 seconds of cranking and what is the actual lift pump pressure, that would help in diagnosing the issue. Letâs now say your batteries are good. Thanks for reaching out to us and sorry to hear about the issues with your truck. When #1 made no change in the fuel return volume, I proceeded to cap #2 (#1 still capped as well). Good luck, and please let us know if you’ve got any other questions. Next, hop in your truck, and âbumpâ the key. had everything checked and they said there is no power going to the injectors. First, you mention you have fuel at the injection pump, but the question is whether you have sufficient fuel, so you’ll want to run the bucket test described in this tutorial to confirm you’re getting enough. Good luck and let us know if you have any other questions or what you come up with. Lift pump comes on and is pumping fuel. Most of the time they are opening too early, not completely open, under no pressure. In regards to the P0088 code you’re getting for higher than desired rail pressure, you were correct in replacing the FCA as that is many times the cause, however, since it did not alleviate your issue, the next step would be to check the rail pressure sensor. Good luck! Thanks for your advice. Yes I cleared the code with my smarty. Good luck in getting the truck back up and running. The simplest way to think about it is like trying to blow up a balloon with a hole in it…..you’ll never create adequate pressure because air (or fuel in this case) is always able to escape, and because these valves are controlled by springs, they will gradually get weaker over time. I’ve capped each injector separately with the miller injector block tool and cranked, but still no luck. Am going to shop to measure injector bypass. The original injectors in the 2004.5-2007, sometimes called the “505” injectors had an exceptionally high failure rate, enough so that Bosch, the original manufacturer, revised them. Its easy to miss. You explain things very well Is this the most likely scenario? Cheap paper writing service provides high-quality essays for affordable prices. The best idea here would be to install a mechanical gauge and literally zip tie it to your windshield wiper and drive around for a bit to check fluctuation. I unplugged the FCA and there is no change in rail pressure (no spike) and will stall within 30-40 second after disconnecting. I read your page on a cummins no start and was wondering if you can help me out. Typically grinding noises would not be associated with fuel lines going to the injection pump. We have numerous options available and if you have any other questions, please do not hesitate to give us a call at (888) 99-DIESEL, send an e-mail to [email protected], or reply to this message, as well. Based upon your description, its most likely one of two things. Once youâve bumped the key, presuming the pump is operating normally, you should see fuel dumping into the bucket. If there is power going to the pump when it will not start, its of course a bad pump again. I followed your excellent instructions all the way up to the injector fuel return volume. I defiantly need to get a rail pressure gauge. Deleted the relief and fired right up. What we would recommend doing first is to check the battery as you’re attempting to crank over the engine, so have one person holding a voltmeter on the battery post watching the voltage drop and another turning the key. I have changed the fuel filter, checked the lift pump with a pressure gauge. Wouldnât crank. Good luck, let us know what happens, please. To much fuel pressure? Still troll shooting the 06′ but have different issue with my 07.5′ 6.7 3500 . Dear Twitpic Community - thank you for all the wonderful photos you have taken over the years. Best ~Valerie~. I do not hear the lift pump run when the no start condition occurs. ran fine driving and idling never skipped a beat. If you’ve got a bad enough leak, again, air will get into the system, and the longer it sits, the more air will get in there, and make it very hard to start. so the tube can properly seat into the dimple on the side of the injector. Was one of my first mods. If its malfunctioning, then it could be causing the light. I live in a mega rural area and mechanics are few and far between. Went to start afterwards and for some reason it shorted out my grid heater literally melted the metal connector between the 2 bolts then fired right up. However, even if you don’t have the grey key, if the ECM cannot communicate with the dash cluster, it would cause the issue you’re experiencing. Now, I am not getting any fuel from the injector return fuel line while cranking. 2003 dodge 2500 Cummins. Working . Good luck! It requires Miller tool 9012 to be installed to isolate the cp3 return from the injector return. Once you hit it with WD-40, its enough flammable gas in the chamber, it fires the truck off of WD-40, bringing fuel into the rail since the CP3 is moving now. As far as I can tell it seems to be the lift pump. Thanks, Shawn B. Usually the fan clutches cause issues when they are plugged in and the wires short out and cause the whole bus to go down. Wish I still had it! Will the computer not allow the truck to start if it reads low oil psi? This sounds exactly like injectors that are returning too much fuel. No issue when warm. I put on new injector line. Good luck, and let us know how things progress. Can this be my problem) 0113 ( not sure what is the cause of the intake air sensor high) 0514 (donât think batt temp sensor performance will affect my no start) 0483( cooling fan speed shouldnât be the problem) 0521 (oil pressure sensor performance, looks like I may have a bad oil pressure sensor but again shouldnât cause a no start?) What was the reasoning for changing the parts in the first place as you say it “will start with and without the FCA…..” or would it not start in the first place? Lastly, if you happened to pinch one of the injector wire during re-assembly. Further, as a side note, 2004 models originally had the lift pump located in the engine bay. Let us know once you get a new return test done as the preliminary test sounds as though it may be causing excessive return. Hi there.The white “foggy stuff” you’re describing sounds like unburnt fuel, typical of a high return rate (injectors going bad) OR insufficient fuel pressure to the injectors, causing the fuel to not properly atomize in the combustion chamber. Good luck, and let us know if you’ve got any other questions. Hopefully its just a lift pump, though. If you have a pinched wire, it could easily be causing a hard or no start issue. I have a 2003 dodge 5.9 cummins. I will definitely call. Please help! We’re sure you are aware at this point, but just in case, P0148 specifically means High Pressure Common Rail Checksum. Well, he said when he was troubleshooting he found a good amount of air in the fuel lines. After changing the fuel filter the fuel pump is not pumping and is not getting any electric? It must be a bad thermostat and thus not associated with the truck stalling/dying? The P0713 code is a trans temp sensor too high, which can be kicked when the wiring is shorted to ground, or the sensor itself is grounded. Presuming the lift pump is good, since you just replaced it (again, making a presumption) look through all of your wiring and fuel pump relay to ensure there is no break or corrosion. It sounds more like a pressure relief valve issue based upon your description. Replaced the lift pump and the truck runs great again. If this is the case, you’d be able to test the return rate of the injectors, which should be no more than 90mL per minute when cranking at 200RPM’s. Presuming so, the trucks fuel mileage is probably down, as well. sometimes it acts like its running out of fuel. 3. sensor reference b voltage low . I’ve noticed a lack of power too. Otherwise, you may be correct in that its time for a new pump. Thanks for the response. While we would recommend reconnecting the wires at the fan, it should not be preventing the truck to start, worst case is you’d typically get a P0483 or P0480 code from the wires being cut. some days it will run fine and others it dont run good at all cuts out and dies when you stop. Gave it a squirt of ether- ran fine all day being turned on and off (with a full tank). After trying everything no luck now I know what your going to say but I tried a sm squirt of either engine fired right up but would only run when throttle was 1/2 or greater will stall when i let it try to idle. my engine revved hi for a couple of seconds b4 i shut it off and now wont start. Great response and additional information, thanks again. We would recommend cracking the feed line to the injection pump and cycle the key to turn the lift pump on. And this is exactly what we will be testing for next, the health of the lift pump. If you are, then I’d recommend disconnecting the chip, returning factory connectors to their original location, clearing the codes, and seeing if they come back. And remember, while pressure is definitely an important factor as this is the rate at which fuel is dispensed, volume is equally, if not more important, as itâs the amount of fuel. Make sure you are only dealing with the line coming from the back of the head. PS: Local diesel shop defaulted to saying the Injector pump needed replaced. You’re welcome. I have a 2007 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9l Diesel showing the p2146 and p2149 codes. Diagnosing an ECM does require a professional grade scanner, but what you can do is visually check over the grounds, the alternator, and power to ensure there’s no corrosion, wire breaks, the usual. The only way to really test the output of the CP3 is to send it to a fuel shop and get it on a test stand. Take A Sneak Peak At The Movies Coming Out This Week (8/12) It’s official: Aaron Rodgers and Shailene Woodley are engaged and we couldn’t be happier Hi there. In order to perform this test, you will need that trusty bucket yet again to capture the return fuel, as well as a small section of hose that will be used to extend the return line somewhere where you can watch and hold the bucket. I’m honestly at a loss. Iâve replaced the fuel filter and it still wonât start. Had it in a garage for fan bearing, mechanic cut wires in front of fan. Not sure where yours is located. There is an o-ring seal that seals the front of the pump to the gear housing that may take some light prying to slide it out. Also there is a constant clicking sound ( like a relay ) at a fairly fast rate coming from drivers side back or lower back of the motor when key is in the on position (not running )have never noticed this before and is hard to locate exactly where it’s coming from. Air in the lines can typically be entered into the system due to “bleed back” of the fuel system, whether the lift pump can’t maintain pressure, or the injection pump, or even the injectors themselves, and if the injectors are still original with over 300k on the odometer, they’re also likely in need of replacing. Dodge released a retrofit kit that would move the pump into the fuel tank’s pickup basket assembly. Does the truck starting with ether change your opinion? This sounds like an instrument cluster failure as I’m not recalling there being an independent fuse for the cluster itself. It sounds like you’re not getting fuel to the cylinders, which is why the RPM doesn’t change when you open the throttle, so its just burning off the Quick Start that’s in there. Cranked till saw fuel before starting test.. Fuel will take the path of least resistance and without physically moving the line off of the top of the valve, fuel coming out of the line will make it look as if it is coming out of the valve. Also, when you change out the fittings on the CP3 with the BOP, did you absolutely make sure that the little tiny ball was reinstalled? Checked fuses and solenoids? I,ve checked grounds and plugs/connections. Could this be reversed + and - on the backs. Negative. It would not start without the fca unplugged but once it started I unplugged it and idle did get rough. All stock except for Edge and exhaust. First thing I’d recommend is to check for any check engine lights and see if that points things in a certain direction. It is assumed that it’s taking this time to build up rail pressure. Hi, I have a 2003 with a 5.9 Cummins. Was thinking of a local ground to frame at the rear. Overall, based upon the information we’ve been given, it does sound like an injector issue. First and foremost, depending on how cold it really is, your grid heater may not be firing, and when it does get relatively cold (lets say around 20 degrees Fahrenheit), the truck will be very difficult / impossible to start. I’m definitely planning on replacing my other battery soon I know that has to be done just not sure if I’m looking at another issue. Tyler has been elbow deep in diesel engines for years, especially Cummins, so he is a wealth of information when trying to cure a plagued engine. That could be a blown fuse or a bad fan clutch itself. I have unplugged the FCA and the rail pressure sensor and tried to start it. I have a 2007 dodge Cummins 6.7 6speed..terminals went bad but would still push start easily..changing out terminals a wrench arched the grid heaters solenoid and has not fired up sense..any ideas would be greatly appreciateed, the truck will run until it gets a half tank of fuel . I removed all the fuel injector lines and capped off the fuel rail. My question now is, suppose it’s only one injector gone bad can I get away with purchasing just one or do you recommend the whole set? There is an end-on view and a side view. And just remember, bigger isnât always better in terms of lift pump choice. My lift pump is located on the side of the filter housing. In case it sheds further light on the matter, thanks to previous discussions on your site I got the idea of using ether to start the truck. No luck. Now very important, if the truck starts, make sure you quickly turn it off, as with the FCA unplugged, there is no metering of the CP3, which means it will run at maximum capacity, causing elevated RPMâs and a rough idle. Did injector return test pull code and it is P0148. Good luck with the diagnosis. If I remember correctly, the IAT must sense 55+ degrees Fahrenheit to trigger the grid heater. I reset the code. I wouldn’t say these fuel systems are necessarily finicky, but there can sometimes be several reasons for a similar symptom. Ps: I’m 200 miles from nearest parts store or garage , so just using what I have out here .Getting towed to the dealer is not an option. As far as the rail pressure circuit high code, that’s caused from starting the truck with the FCA unplugged. In the instances when your truck will not start, confirm if you can hear the lift pump cycling by turning the key to the on position and listening in the engine bay. Each of the six injectors in your engine will return fuel. Engine running fine 30 MPH, then suddenly all dash board gauges died. I’ve noticed if you wait longer it takes a bit longer to crank and finally fires. Either location will allow you to see a pressure drop if that is occurring. This can be done by removing the return line at the rear of the head and plumbing it into a bucket that can collect the return flow.
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